[Ger-Poland-Volhynia] DNA Testing?

Gerald Klatt gerald.klatt at shaw.ca
Wed Sep 11 12:25:13 PDT 2013

Same question from me. I eagerly wait the reply.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dan Buss" <dbuss at rogers.com>
To: "Otto" <otto at schienke.com>; "SGGEElistserv list" 
<ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2013 12:10 PM
Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] DNA Testing?

> Hello Otto,
> Read your Epistle to the Non-believers, and am still left with the major 
> question of: How in the world does this DNA thing link you or me to the 
> past people long gone without them having provided a sample spit, or 
> whatever?????.
> Dan B.
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Otto" <otto at schienke.com>
> To: "SGGEElistserv list" <ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 11, 2013 11:52 AM
> Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] DNA Testing?
>> Good morning Listers!
>> The question has been asked many times.  I've wanted to submit a reply 
>> but did not take time to do so. . . so many e-letters to type.
>> But then, perhaps I just procrastinate.
>> I know there are many on the List and also SGGEE members who have taken 
>> the test I am discussing here, one I feel is a helper to paper-trail 
>> research. The participants can speak for themselves. I am willing to 
>> answer questions limited to this test and its use but will do so 
>> privately.
>> I am involved in both paper-trail and DNA research and receive the same 
>> delight from a new paper record of a past relative of mine as from a DNA 
>> match without a paper. The signature of a g.g.g. grandfather on paper, 
>> Wow.-the DNA genetic shift because of just one marital union, Wow.
>> This is today, we cannot have the chicken without the egg. Both is 
>> better. Like a right and left hand washing dishes. SGGEE and 23andMe, a 
>> symbiotic relationship.
>> The question that has come to the fore ofttimes, "Of what value is DNA 
>> testing?
>> There must be a value because the field is growing tremendously.
>> DNA testing proves to be an adjunct to paper-trail research.
>> Paper-trail research proves to be an adjunct to DNA trail research.
>> I see no difference between the two. . . except DNA records are more 
>> accurate.
>> Paper-trail offers a written legal pedigree, that is, in accordance with 
>> all the relevant rules.
>> DNA offers a biological pedigree (we must view ourselves as a lump of 
>> information, code; no bluffing in the code).
>> I always think of a stateside cartoon series (the funny paper) of the 
>> past; Popeye, the sailer-man and his saying, "I yam what I yam and tha's 
>> all what I yam."  So goes it with DNA testing.
>> "What benefit is DNA testing for paper-trail genealogy?"
>> Civil paper records "state" I am my father's son. They are my legal 
>> identification.
>> *note: A woman on the DNA site enjoyed the test so much (all of that 
>> info!) but not possessing a Y chromosome (female are X~X, no male Y~X) 
>> badgered her paper-trail father into taking the test, paid for it as a 
>> stimulus. He finally agreed. She waited impatiently for the results-they 
>> finally arrived!  No match. . . not your father. . .Time to talk to Mom.
>> DNA biological records prove it out. They are biological identification.
>> DNA testing has released many persons wrongly convicted on criminal 
>> charges.
>> Types of DNA testing:
>> "STR" testing for "Haplotype" will prove out that I am my son's father.
>> Short Tandem Repeats -STR, a favorite in forensics.
>> and 23andMe spit-testing
>> "SNP" testing for "Haplogroup" (23andme) will provide a 23 chromosome, 
>> 1,000,000 + markers big picture test leading into the distant past.
>> Single Nucleotide polymorphism -SNPs,  valuable in study of disease 
>> development and critical in personalized medicine. For genealogy purposes 
>> it provides a 23 chromosome based view of what genes a person is knit 
>> from.
>> -It creates a "Y-Haplogroup", based on the Y chromosome which contains 
>> markers passed from father to father to father into the distant past.
>> My Y-Haplogroup is R1b1b2a1a1*, the base group is "R" and each character 
>> after the initial R represents a mutation, for example, 
>> 1-b-1-b-2-a-1-a-1-*,  the asterisk marks an as of yet unclassified 
>> mutation.  I refer to it as Mother Nature's latest software code update.
>> -it creates a mtDNA-Haplogroup, based on the DNA of mitochondria in the 
>> red blood cells, passed from mother to mother to mother and so on into 
>> the distant past.
>> My mtDNA-Haplogroup is H1, the base group is "H" and each character after 
>> the initial H represents a mutation.
>> So. . . What has it offered me besides my health scenario. . . (Yo! 
>> Mon!-Sheesh, I thought so. . . now I know it for sure and live 
>> accordingly)
>> Health includes Health Risks, Drug Response, Inherited Conditions, 
>> Traits, Health Tools
>> DNA testing pointed me to the shorelines of the North Sea and beyond, 
>> laying claim to being an ancient inhabitant of Doggerland, now lying 
>> beneath the North Sea since the last glacial meltdown.  This immediately 
>> redirected my paper-trail research to the Baltic Sea coast and west to 
>> the North Sea coast.  The "Cluster Effect" came to the fore as I searched 
>> for similar peoples moving along the coast to eastern territories. I am 
>> making headway-"can't know where you are going until you know where you 
>> coming from."
>> What else did genetic testing with 23andme provide for me?
>> -It provided me with my "Ancestry Composition"- My mixed gene bag of who 
>> I really am. Amazing!
>> -It provided me with my "Maternal Line" History (research can also be 
>> conducted online (google, Wiki,etc) using just the haplogroup characters)
>> -It provided me with my "Paternal Line" History (ditto)
>> -It provide me with my "Neanderthal Ancestry" (2.6%. . . my deceased wife 
>> always accused me of carrying some markers-I accused her family of 
>> carrying many markers. . . her brother tested Y-haplogroup R1b1b2a1a1. . 
>> . @ 2.9% Neanderthal (yeh! I knew it!)
>> Well, I at least remain the latest haplogroup update. . .*)
>> -"Ancestry Tools" box has a variety of algorithms to play with-I like 
>> "Global Similarity."
>> -It provided me (to date)  "DNA Relatives.", with 766 biological 
>> relatives.
>> Some are paper-trail verified-(They must also be spit-tested and part of 
>> the database group.)
>> A few verified paper-trailers follow:
>> I ran 23andme application ("Family Traits" algorithm) and tested myself 
>> against myself. . . Yup! 100% me.  "I yam what I yam and tha's all what I 
>> yam."
>> I ran their application (algorithm) and tested myself against my son. . 
>> .50% me. (it is my son!)
>> I ran their application (algorithm) and tested myself against my first 
>> cousin. .  Yup! 1st cousin maternal side!
>> I ran their application (algorithm) and tested myself against my 3rd 
>> cousin. . . 3rd cousin he is!
>> -Without a present day paper-trail ID, in  "DNA Relatives.", Norman Radke 
>> rates as a 5th cousin, his offspring rate as cousins, Donald Miller rates 
>> as a 5th cousin, Earl Schultz rates as a 10th cousin and so on. Albert 
>> Muth and I are very similar genetically but not part of a direct line of 
>> descent even though Albert is also a cousin to Donald Miller. . . and 
>> Meta Fife.
>> This is just the beginning. Many more names will be added to the  "DNA 
>> Relatives" relative list.  Once a DNA connection is established, contact 
>> must be established and a paper-trail connection needs to be made.  In 
>> checking the 23andme site for the number of cousins, I noticed another 
>> close female relative I have the paper-trail for. . . Gotta write to her.
>> -It provides me with my "Gene Comparison" to the rest of the 23andme 
>> group. ( birds of a feather do flock together)
>> It provides me with my "Family Traits", an application, (algorithm) which 
>> I use to compare my genes with all who have agreed to share with me at 
>> 23andme. Your  actual DNA code is never seen by others and vice-versa. 
>> 23andme computer algorithms do the work for you. Quickly.
>> -One can also participate in their research. . .  With paper-trail and 
>> DNA trail pursuits, my time is limited.
>> -A "Community Site" and "Blog" exists for answers to questions.
>> . . .   Otto
>>         " The Zen moment..." wk. of January 01, 2013-
>>                _____________________________________
>>                  "Answers out there . . .  Seeking us."
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